Requests for Tolkien Research Assistance

Merry · Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:31 pm Post subject:

There is also the famous Old Winyards from Bilbo's cellar! I like the sound of Dorwinion, too, though it is in the North Kingdom and maybe not the Mediterranean climate.

If you were looking for something in the south, though, my guess would have been Lossarnach, which also seems to be full of gardens. And Forlong the Fat came from there!

Lindariel · Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 8:07 pm Post subject:

elentarivarda · Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:26 pm Post subject:

Well, this whole thread was terribly interesting! Very Happy

I look forward to more topics!

I remember my first trip to Europe and the main thing that stood out to me were the vineyards. They were just so beautiful. Very Happy

I think I'd love to visit this part of Middle-earth. I've never been as interested in the Shire, as others seem to be. The forests, esp. Mirkwood, and now this "Dorwinion" are far more interesting to me! Very Happy

Merry · Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2010 10:27 pm Post subject:

I'm doing a little writing this semester on Tolkien and I could use some help thinking. One part of my paper tries to make the claim that some of the characters in LOTR can be seen in terms of priest, prophet, and king, roles to which Catholics are called to fulfill in our baptism liturgy. It's pretty well known, of course, that the Church doesn't call all of us to those roles in a literaral sense. (That's okay: I'm not bitter because I can't be a priest! Twisted Evil

) But there's a metaphorical sense of these terms, also.

Anyway, probably the weakest part of my claim is that Aragorn functions as a kind of Old Testament priest. Yes, there were Hebrew priests in the OT, descendents of Aaron and of the tribe of Levi. Besides maintaining their lineage, their primary job was to lead rituals. It's pretty easy to see how Aragorn's lineage was the most impressive in LOTR, and I think that his handling of athelas and his absolution and funeral rite for Boromir fit this role. But can anybody think of any other ritual elements in Aragorn's actions?

Thanks in advance! This would help a lot.

Riv Res · Manwë Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 1302

Merry, I think that the events at Minas Tirith are full of rituals that Aragorn brings with him. I think that it is more evident in that part of the story than anywhere else.

The refusal to enter the city as a triumphant King before he is crowned. He enters as a healer in diguise. This has always seemed to me to smack more of ritual and tradition than sheer modesty.

The whole House of Healing chapter speaks to the healing powers of, and ritual of the King as a healer.

The coronation where he has Faramir bring him the crown and Aragorn says the unforgettable... "Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome Maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!"

The whole ritual after he was crowned where he came to the barrier and Húrin of the Keys opened it and Aragorn went through the flower filled streets.

When Aragorn finds and takes the white sapling back to the city and replaces the White Tree.

Lindariel · Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:38 am Post subject:

I think also of the almost ritualistic way in which Gandalf presents the palantir to Aragorn and Aragorn accepts it:

Merry · Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:44 am Post subject:

You gals are awesome!

Lindariel · Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:34 am Post subject:

Merry, I'm a Protestant born and raised (United Church of Christ as a child, the Episcopal Church as an adult). Could I ask if the Catholic Church also speaks of its followers sometimes as "warriors of/for Christ?" There are a number of Protestant hymns, for instance, "Soldiers of Christ arise and put your armor on," etc., that evoke the theme of the Church Militant. In the interest of being all-inclusive, would it be appropriate for your paper also to address Aragorn's most obvious role as Warrior-King? He really is all of these roles in one -- Warrior-Priest-Healer-Prophet-King.

Merry · Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:01 am Post subject:

I wish I were a theologian (well, not really, but it would be handy right now!). Before Vatican II, a time of which I have only a dim memory, Catholics spoke of being a 'soldier for Christ'; when I was confirmed, at the tender age of seven, the bishop still struck the confirmed on the face as a sign that we were soldiers for Christ. (We all looked forward to that with trepidation, thinking the bishop was really going to sock it to us, but it was more of a gentle ceremonial tap!) But I'm not sure we ever talked about the Church Militant, or if being a warrior was in the same category as priest, prophet, king. The important part of the question, though, is whether the Catholic Church of Tolkien's time believed in this.

I need to ask an expert. I'll get back to you.

Lindariel · Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:16 pm Post subject:

Clearly, today when we speak of being "Soldiers of/for Christ," we are speaking in the spiritual/evangelical sense, and the armor is spiritual armor. However, if we think back to The Crusades, being a "Soldier of/for Christ" literally meant strapping on a sword and going to war. Even more recently, especially during the World Wars and other more contemporary conflicts, it was not unheard-of for chaplains at the front to bear a side-arm for self-protection and the protection of the wounded and defenseless in their care. Would this have resonance for your paper as well?

Merry · Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:41 pm Post subject:

Maybe so. I'll have to think about it more. I do think that when Aragorn strapped on his sword and went to war, his motivation was beyond nationalism. Since his 'enemy' was Sauron, it was sort of a religious war. But in the Real World, I imagine Tolkien was very suspicious of that kind of motivation.