Tolkien Trivia

Lindariel · Post by **Lindariel** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 10:27 pm

Here's clue -- check the poems in The Hobbit and LOTR.

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 5:29 am

I can remember only two versions: the sort of 'starting out' version and the 'coming home' version. (As a way to stave off the Alzheimer's, I try to do these from memory alone.

)

Lindariel · Post by **Lindariel** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:32 pm

Sorry to have been out of touch for a while. I have been out of town.

Since we seem to be a bit stumped, I'll fill you in:

The first occurrence is towards the end of The Hobbit. Bilbo and Gandalf have left Rivendell and our intrepid little hobbit is very nearly home:

Coming to a rise he could see his own Hill in the distance, and he stopped suddenly and said:

Roads go ever ever on,
Over rock and under tree,
By caves where never sun has shone,
By streams that never find the sea;
Over snow by winter sown,
And through the merry flowers of June,
Over grass and over stone,
And under mountains in the moon.

Roads go ever ever on,
Under cloud and under star,
Yet feet that wandering have gone
Turn at last to home afar.
Eyes that fire and sword have seen
And horror in the halls of stone
Look at last on meadows green
And trees and hills they long have known.

Gandalf looked at him. "My dear Bilbo!" he said. "Something is the matter with you! You are not the hobbit that you were."

And as we all know, indeed, Bilbo was much changed by his great adventure.

The next appearance of this theme happens as Bilbo departs Bag End forever at the beginning of FOTR:

"Take care! I don't care. Don't you worry about me! I am as happy now as I have ever been, and that is saying a great deal. But the time has come. I am being swept off my feet at last," he added, and then in a low voice, as if to himself, he sang softly in the dark:

The Road goes ever on and on
Down from the door where it began.
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
And I must follow, if I can,
Pursuing it with eager feet,
Until it joins some larger way
Where many paths and errands meet.
And whither then? I cannot say.

The next iteration of this theme comes not from Bilbo, but from Frodo during the second day out from Bag End at the beginning of his dire journey:

"The road goes on for ever," said Pippin; "but I can't without a rest. It is high time for lunch" . . . . "Do Elves live in those woods?" he [Sam] asked.

"Not that I ever heard," said Pippin. Frodo was silent. He too was gazing eastward along the road, as if he had never seen it before. Suddenly he spoke, aloud but as if to himself, saying slowly:

The Road goes ever on and on
Down from the door where it began.
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
And I must follow, if I can.
Pursuing it with weary feet,
Until it joins some larger way,
Where many paths and errands meet.
And whither then? I cannot say.

"That sounds like a bit of old Bilbo's rhyming," said Pippin. "Or is it one of your imitations? It does not sound altogether encouraging."

"I don't know," said Frood. "It came to me then, as if I was making it up; but I may have heard it long ago. Certainly it reminds me very much of Bilbo in the last years, before he went away. He used often to say there way only one Road; that it was like a great river: its springs were at every doorstep, and every path was its tributary. 'It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out of your door,' he used to say. 'You step into the Road, and if you don't keep your feet, there is no knowing where you might be swept off to.'"

Then, towards the end of ROTK, when our intrepid hobbits have returned at last to Rivendell and their beloved Bilbo, he has one last interpretation of this beautiful theme:

"I evidently came back by much too straight a road from my trip. I think Gandalf might have shown me round a bit. But then the auction would have been over before I got back, and I should have had even more trouble than I did. Anyway it's too late now; and really I think it's much more comfortable to sit here and hear about it all. The fire's very cosy here, and the food's very good, and there are Elves when you want them. What more could one want?"

The Road goes ever on and on
Out from the door where it began.
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
Let others follow it who can!
Let them a journey new begin,
But I at last with weary feet
Will turn towards the lighted inn,
My evening-rest and sleep to meet.

Just one of the many beauties to explore within The Professor's marvelous work is this extraordinary theme of the Road.

Merry, since you hazarded a guess from memory -- and a rather good one it was -- why don't you give us the next question?

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:46 am

Well, not really such a good guess! Good scholarship, as always, Lindariel.

I'll have something by tomorrow night.

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Tue Jan 27, 2009 4:46 am

Name the seven sons of Feanor.

(Now I know that anyone could just look this up, but let's see how many we can get from memory first!)

Lindariel · Post by **Lindariel** » Tue Jan 27, 2009 2:53 pm

I can come up with five of them from memory:

Maedhros, Maglor, Curufin (the really nasty one), Amrod, and Amras

I know the other two begin with a C -- I think one is Celegorm, but I may be wrong. The last one escapes me at the moment.

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Tue Jan 27, 2009 3:55 pm

Good memory! You're right about Celegorm and that the last one begins with a C.

I've always thought it was kind of strange that the sons of Feanor had names that in no way resembled 'Feanor'. That seemed to be the custom in Middle-earth, e.g., Aragorn son of Arathorn. Maybe that's why they turned out so badly! Or maybe it had something to do with the nasty oath.

Anybody remember the name of the last son?

Riv Res · Post by **Riv Res** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:40 pm

Was it Amras, Merry?

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:01 pm

Oops! I have been ambiguous: although Amras was Feanor's last son, Lindariel already listed him above. I meant the one Lindariel didn't name, whose name begins with a C.

Time to consult the text!

Riv Res · Post by **Riv Res** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:59 pm

Curufin?

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:08 am

Lindariel has listed him as well.

Riv Res · Post by **Riv Res** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:23 am

Then the only other 'C' that I remember is Caranthir.

Merry · Post by **Merry** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:46 am

On the nose!

Your turn--

Riv Res · Post by **Riv Res** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:07 am

OK...

Who took over command of the armies of Morgul after the Witchking of Angmar was slain?

Lindariel · Post by **Lindariel** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:55 pm

Riv, that would be Gothmog, the Lieutenant of Minas Morgul.

In Tolkien's canon, there were in fact TWO Gothmogs. Here's the entry from The Encyclopedia of Arda concerning this one:

Gothmog: Lieutenant to the Lord of the Nazgûl at the Battle of the Pelennor - he took command of the forces of Minas Morgul after the loss of his lord.

Almost nothing is known about Gothmog - in fact, it isn't even possible to say what race of beings he belonged to (see note 1 below). His only recorded action was at the Battle of the Pelennor Fields, following the loss of his master: in response to the arrival of the Rohirrim, he called his army's reserve out of Osgiliath and into the main battle. That aside, the details of Gothmog's nature and role must remain in the realms of speculation.

Notes
1. Gothmog is mentioned precisely once in The Lord of the Rings, and we're given absolutely no clues about his race. As second-in-command to the Lord of the Nazgûl himself, he clearly had very great authority over Sauron's forces, and this has led some to suggest that Gothmog was also one of the Nazgûl. This by no means impossible, but it is notable that Frodo and Sam, who saw the Witch-king lead his armies from Minas Morgul, only observed one Nazgûl leading the host.

Others have speculated that Gothmog might have been a Man. We know that the Lieutenant of Barad-dûr was a Man (a descendant of the Black Númenóreans), so it seems perfectly plausible that the Lieutenant of Morgul might come from the same race. What's more, the Witch-king's companions, as seen by Frodo and Sam, do seem to have been Men.

The idea of Gothmog being an Orc seems rather less likely, but even that possibility cannot be dismissed. Ultimately, there's no hard evidence about Gothmog's race.

2. The name Gothmog was originally given to a mighty Balrog of the Elder Days, one of the greatest servants of Morgoth the first Dark Lord. Its meaning is unclear, and several possibilities exist, such as 'Dread Enforcer', 'Voice of Morgoth' or 'Black Master'.

Here's my Level 1 question:

Who are the olvar and the kelvar, and which one of the Valar is the most concerned with them?